Naturally, this story started a discussion between me and True's Official Consulting Pastor, Dr. Rev. Rus Jeffrey, who is the Senior Pastor (read: boss) of a church in Upstate New York. (He also understands e-mail publishing, as he runs several lists of his own -- check out the "Communications" section of his site's nav bar.) Below is a transcript of the most interesting part of the discussion.

Rus: It's interesting that Jesus himself was also accused of following "Satan" because He was casting out demons.

Randy: What's the reference for that?

Rus: Matthew 12:22-24 --

22: Then they brought him a demon-possessed man who was blind and mute, and Jesus healed him, so that he could both talk and see. 23: All the people were astonished and said, "Could this be the Son of David?" 24: But when the Pharisees heard this, they said, "It is only by Beelzebub, the prince of demons, that this fellow drives out demons." (New International Version)

Randy: I especially like verse 25 --

Jesus knew their thoughts and said to them, "Every kingdom divided against itself will be ruined, and every city or household divided against itself will not stand."

-- doesn't this very much describe American Christianity today? I mean, forget "Christians vs. Moslems", think "Southern Baptist vs. First Baptist" or various Lutheran Synods vs. each other, let alone "Born Again vs Unitarian"!! Isn't all of American Christianity a "house divided", as it's usually uttered?

Rus: sigh. Yes, so very true. Then of course even those who claim they want you to be ecumenical (that's the $25 theological word for Christian unity) come against you when you actually do it! (Speaking from experience of course when suddenly a denomination said they didn't like me "interacting" with other streams.)

Randy: So how do you address this? Seems to me that it's an important point.

Rus: You mean how do I personally address it? By always pointing out that it's wrong. By modeling for the people who follow me the right way to live with one another and be speaking words of "life" instead of "death." I actually had to address this with one of our leaders here not too long ago. I heard he was saying things he shouldn't be saying. So, I sat him down and reminded him of Proverbs 6:16-19. In that passage it says there are "six things the Lord hates, and the seventh He abhors....sowing dissension among the brethren." I reminded him that when we say things about others it's out of line and it causes "dissension" even when we usually say "I didn't mean to make anyone mad." I simply don't put up with it.

Sometimes I simply point out that even though we don't agree with what someone else might think, it does not give us permission to abuse them verbally. Again, that's "sowing dissension." Sometimes I simply smile and say -- "Well, I guess that person isn't living up to their full potential yet. But then again, they probably figure we aren't living up to our full potential either." :-)